Unified Serbo

There, I have to disagree with you. Some very competent and long-time regular editors here may choose not to comment in a discussion, wow gold but still may have an informed vote to cast. Did Semper join in the discussion? If not, would you "throw out" his vote, however he might choose to cast it? Votes are votes. If you think requirements for voting should be instituted, then you ought to start that discussion in the WT:BP and later take it to a vote. However, no such requirements currently exist. --EncycloPetey 13:45, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I certainly wouldn't struck votes of any of the regulars - but simply mentioned that only folks that showed interest in this proposal should be (in my opinion) allowed to vote. With striking - I primarily referred to votes of folks with no or insignificant number of edits like Pepsi Lite, who are obviously not voting with a logical evaluation of the proposal in mind, but for various political and ideological reasons which do not concern us here. The opposing votes done in good faith are perfectly valid. Unfortunately, I don't think many of them are such. --Ivan Štambuk 13:50, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I agree with Robert Ullmann. I mean, I don't completely agree with him: unlike him, I feel that unless Pepsi Lite shows some desire to actually contribute here, his/her vote should not be counted; we don't have a contribution threshold for voting, but that's hardly an open invitation to Wikipedians to come impose their views on us. But I agree with him that you should not be the one to strike votes, nor the one to close the vote. If we had objective criteria for striking votes, and for deciding whether a vote has passed, I would obviously trust you to follow those criteria; but given that all we have are subjective guidelines and our best efforts to examine votes dispassionately, your many angry comments here disqualify you in my eyes. --RuakhTALK 13:54, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I really hope that vote-striking will be unnecessary and that the proposal is buy wow gear likely to pass after all. If it doesn't, then we could deal with the problem of bad-intention votes done by external editors (not of Wiktionary, but of sister projects, possibly in other languages.) --Ivan Štambuk 14:05, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I believe that our barriers to broad participation in votes are already so high as wow gold to make these votes almost meaningless as a reflection of the interests of the user community, WMF, sister projects, and occasional contributors. For a matter such as this we should be welcoming broader participation. Every restriction on participation is a step away from wikiness toward ivory-towerdom.

I would particularly have welcomed the chance to hear from a large number of native speakers of the language(s)/language family/ISO codes involved. Under our practice of not advertising votes, it is hard to see how that would be possible. This is an occasion in which we will be the worse for not being able to obtain the information that broader participation would garner. DCDuring TALK 14:14, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

You have had a chance to involve participants from FL sister projects in wow items the discussions we held in the last several months. And some indeed commented. There's no point in dragging a bunch of Balkan nationalists to cast their opposing votes here, and then leave for good. --Ivan Štambuk 14:27, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

While I see the reasons given by the voter as dubious, there is no constraint on the quality wow items or plausibility of reasoning in the voting policies. Thus the vote is valid, AFAICT. nothing other than express his disagreement with the proposal on the basis of the nationality of the person who proposed it. Formally valid, but let's just hope that there won't be too many of these. --Ivan Štambuk 14:56, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

But there's simply no reason not to stick to the term that is used in 99% of English literature That's no completely true. It would be more correct to say, that there's no reason you are accepting. It's a fact that there was tension between the main groups in former Yugoslavia. These groups have closely related language variants. These language variants could be compared to a multiple star system. Each star is separate when looked at from a point near to the system, but they are gravitationally bound and form only one star when looked at from a point farer away.

As said before, there was tension between the groups of former Yugoslavia and they have chosen to look upon their language variants as four different languages. This is official policy in all four countries. Language and ethnicity is very much about identity and in the Southern Slavic area ethnicity has proven to be more important for the identity than language. They have decided to break up the language along ethnic borders and to maintain four closely related but different languages. They _do not_ want to share a common identity with the other groups. And outsiders have to respect this decision. Just like calling a Catalan a Spaniard against his will is disrespectful, or calling an Inuit an Eskimo against his will is disrespectful or like calling an African-American a negro or even worse against his will is disrespectful. If a religious/ethnic/linguistic etc. group says "Please call us X, but don't call us Y" it is a matter of respect to call them X and not Y. If the Montenegrins say "please refer to our language as Montenegrin and not as Serbo-Croatian for we are no Croats and no Serbs" this should be accepted. --Slomox 20:44, 21 July 2009 (UTC)
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